Saturday, September 20, 2008

Pro-Abortion Views Disqualify Candidates from Catholic Support, per Bishop Vasa

From LifeSite via spoke with Bishop Vasa after the session. Describing the deliberation among US bishops over the "Faithful Citizenship" document, he said: "When we were working on the document 'Faithful Citizenship', and the issue of whether or not a person's adamant pro-abortion position was a disqualifying condition, the general sense was 'yes that is a disqualifying condition'."

Not only that, but for all the folks who love to cite "proportionality":

However, during the discussions mention was made of the document by Pope Benedict just prior his elevation to the pontificate which noted that Catholics may in good conscience vote for a politician who supports abortion in the presence of "proportionate reasons." Bishop Vasa explained the notion of proportionate reasons, saying, "The conditions under which an individual may be able to vote for a pro-abortion candidate would apply only if all the candidates are equally pro-abortion."

Which of course re-affirms what the Church has said all along. There is nothing proportional to the killing of an unborn child. Pushing even further, His Excellency brings up the point that pro-abortion Catholics love to harp on, namely, the Iraq War:

Only when taken to a level of insanity could a 'pro-war' candidate be considered on par with a pro-abortion candidate in the Bishop's view. "If we had a candidate in favor of a war in Iraq in which we decimate the entire population and we kill as many civilians to impose as much terror on everybody as possible to make sure . . . If that was in opposition to a pro-abortion person then I'd have a real conflict of conscience because you'd have a direct and intentional killing of innocent persons on one hand and the direct and intentional killing of persons on the other hand", said the Baker Bishop.

Here endeth the lesson.


Santiago Chiva, Granada said...

On the topic of abortion, even many people who defend the possibility of legal abortions, they say they are not pro-abortion, but they don’t want to punish women who are in this difficult situation. In Germany a curious thing has happened. Something that reflects that legal abortion affects adversely to the country. And also that the change is possible: you can promote a culture of life with the support of the citizens, when really there is a real wish of avoid abortions. Since the liberalization of abortion in this country, the number of abortions is officially four million. For that reason, among others, children are seen as an unintended effect of having sex. Many people thought it was necessary to promote greater social acceptance of children in an aging society. And civil society acted, without waiting for action by the State to promote births. They joined several media organizations in a campaign. Interestingly, after the campaign, the birth rate has risen in Germany. The video is exciting. Look here:
Santiago Chiva (Granada, Spain)

Haskovec said...

While I certainly agree that one can't vote for the pro-abortion candidate. Likewise I don't feel that one can vote for the pro-war candidate. Given that the Iraq war if not a just war via the just war doctrine, and also given that you have a candidate in McCain who is very belligerent and threatens Iran and wants to continue this cycle of war, logically isn't the only option for a catholic in good conscience to vote 3rd party. Since the bishops affirm it is our civic duty to vote, that leaves out not voting, so wouldn't one have to vote for a third party whom opposes abortion and the war. Which would probably lead you to the constitution party or some libertarian candidates (depends on the candidates as libertarians seem to be split on the issue).

Throwback said...

To Mr. Chiva: Thanks for the comment and the youtube reference. Hopefully, awareness of all this is spreading and people will wake up a bit.

Throwback said...

To Haskovec:

There's a bit of a difference there. First, I get your point about not voting for a pro-war candidate. The problem with the Iraq situation is that, while one could conclude that the invasion was an injustice (unless you are willing to accept that our reasons for going there were Iraqi liberation, which I'm not sure if anyone buys that), the occupation does not fall in the same camp.

It seems to me that we would be committing an even greater sin to abandon the region in its current plight. The ongoing nature of the conflict is more a function of necessity, it seems to me, than the perhaps specious reasons for invading in the first place.

Second, I haven't seen McCain make any statements like those mentioned by Bishop Vasa or that indicate the sort of certitude of unjust wars the way an Obama presidency would yield a certitude of more laxity for abortions. To the contrary, I think McCain's rhetoric has softened a bit. The lesson seems to have been learned about going off half-cocked.

I've had some folks suggest that voting for the Constitutional Party would be like handing the keys over to Obama or whatever other pro-abortion candidate might be running. I'm not sure what I think of this. Buying into what many seem to regard as a broken two-party system doesn't seem to be in the public or Church's interest either.

No candidate is ever going to be perfect. The only thing I'm trying to be clear on is that some imperfections vastly outweigh all others.

Haskovec said...

Well I still stand by what I said before in that I don't think a Catholic in Good conscience can vote for either Obama or McCain based on their positions towards life, when there are acceptable candidates running in the third parties. If all the Catholics went out and voted for Chuck Baldwin at about 25% of the country it would send such a wake up call to the 2 parties that our issues would be addressed. Anyway Thomas Woods wrote an article entitled Pro-Lifers for Murder that is worth a read:

Throwback said...

I think Woods is mostly right there, though I think that he is overplaying McCain's march to war. Call it naivete, I just don't think that McCain is looking to fight anyone else right now (especially with a nuclear power), any more than I think that Obama will be bringing the troops home anytime soon.

I'm not comfortable voting for McCain by any means. I've voted for the Constitutional Party in the past. I just don't think McCain can spare my vote in a race like this where I am much more certain of quite awful results should Obama become president.

By the way, it's not really relevant here because I agree with you on most points about the Iraq War (with the exception of the occupation being separate from the invasion, I guess), but I know you are interested in the topic, so here's my book rec.: